Lezleonardo - Lezleonardo

God you worded my thoughts beautifully, 100% agreed.

Hii! I hope you are having a good day! I have a question concerning Wei Wuxian and Lan Wangji’s righteousness. Also I think this might also be a hot take? Many people have said that Wangxian are the only morally upright people in the novel, but in Lan Wangji’s case that's only when he matured yes?

I'm not trying to say Lan Wangji is not righteous, he is! He is better than most of the cultivators in the gentry, that's how he got his title after all. I'm just confused because I have seen people claiming that he is just as good as Wei Wuxian (before Wei Wuxian's death).

If Lan Wangji really was as good as Wei Wuxian that time. Why didn't he put the same effort in helping the Wen remnants the same way Wei Wuxian did? Why didn't he go and confirm whether or not the Wen remnants really were being unjustly abused?

Wei Wuxian gave up his reputation, his clan, his comfort, and nearly everything to save the Wen remnants. And I'm sorry to say this (I'm not trying to hate, I'm just stating facts), Lan Wangji didn't.

My problem isn't with Lan Wangji (I adore him). My problem is people saying to say that Lan Wangji was as righteous as Wei Wuxian pre-Wei Wuxian death. Yes, Lan Wangji did try to help Wei Wuxian (defending Wei Wuxian several times in the cultivation meetings, and supporting Mianmian, helping Wen Ning when he was just awakened). But my problem is when people equate those actions to what Wei Wuxian did with the Wen remnants. Lan Wangji at that time did not put in the same effort to help the Wen remnants just as Wei Wuxian did. That's what I'm trying to say. Lan Wangji pre-Wei Wuxian was still maturing, he has some hesitationto help the Wen remnants back then, he was not as good as Wei Wuxian back then. BUT Lan Wangji IS as good as Wei Wuxian post-Wei Wuxian death. He learned from his mistakes, and acted with more conviction to do the right thing.

Also another question, what made Lan Wangji hesitate to help Wei Wuxian all that much in the past (Wen remnants case)? Was it because of his family and clan? Or was it some other factor? Was he hindered in some way?

What do you think about this?

Hi anon, I’m not really recovered enough to do meta, but you caught me in a good mood, so I’ll give you some answers anyway.

First off I think that take that literally only Wangxian are morally upright is a liiiiittle reductionist, because that erases for example Mianmian and the juniors and Wen Qing and Wen Ning and a-Qing and Xiao Xingchen, all of whom are people who we know to have strong morals and the fortitude to do the right thing in the face of loud opposition and societal disapproval. But also I think that while Lan Wangji’s morality is much more apparent in the present, it is consistently strong throughout the entire novel. He just doesn’t shout about it.

First off, given the Wen Remnants claim, Wei Wuxian leaves right from the banquet to go chase them down, which is something he can do without incurring greater societal rancor because he was not a guest at the banquet. Lan Wangji is a guest and both host and guests do have rules and expectations to follow that would make it much more difficult for him to chase after Wei Wuxian without bringing down ire upon the Lan too. Remember, at this time in the book, the Lan Clan is still rebuilding their home that was burnt down with the help of the Jin, they are not quite as free to do as they please as the Jiang are. By the time he would have been able to get there, Wei Wuxian would have already spirited away the Wen from Qiongqi Path, meaning there’d be nothing for him to see. In addition it’s not as if he’s doing nothing at the banquet, he speaks in defense of Wei Wuxian both against the Jin and his own family, which is not doing nothing by any means. He’s fighting on different battlegrounds because he and Wei Wuxian are in different positions.

As for your latter questions, I wonder if you’ve ever heard of the concept attacking on two fronts? Yes, Wei Wuxian sacrificed everything to protect the Wen and give them time, but for all of that sacrifice, it’s doing nothing to stop the roar of the mob. He is an imposing figure to be sure, but he is one man and they are many. In addition, he is mostly staying in one place and working on keeping them alive, meaning that while the Wen are safe, everyone else who is not a cultivator is still having to deal with the hypocrisy of the cultivation world alone, which is where Lan Wangji, who appears wherever chaos is and helps people with their problems however small they seem. In addition to that, he is also continually speaking out at meetings on Wei Wuxian and the Wens’ behalf, we see him do this at the same meeting as Mianmian leaving her clan and we know he spoke up other times from when he and Wen Ning chat on the boat. Just because he wasn’t there in the burial mounds doesn’t mean he wasn’t doing anything and his morality was more questionable, it means that he was fighting those battles on other fronts - fronts where Wei Wuxian could not go, where Lan Wangji does have more power because he is a clan heir, because he is Hanguang-jun, because he is someone noble and strong willed enough to stand up to the bloodthirsty mob again and again and keep shouting back.

Also anon, the reason why Lan Wangji hesitated to “help” Wei Wuxian that much in the past (which he doesn’t, he gets rebuffed by Wei Wuxian half the times when he tries to help and successfully gets to help the other times) comes mostly down to Phoenix Mountain, where he made a significant, grievous error and crossed lines he should not have crossed with Wei Wuxian and that is what shakes up his confidence in helping Wei Wuxian for a while. He’s ashamed of himself for acting the way he did and wronging Wei Wuxian in his actions and it is that dissonance between his wants to be moral and his wants with Wei Wuxian that rattle and force him to spend time rectifying things. He keeps his distance and is cautious and careful with Wei Wuxian because the last time he did what he wanted heedless of what Wei Wuxian wanted, he ended up pinning him to a tree while blindfolded and forcing a kiss on him. That isn’t something that he is taking lightly, and it is clear that it has shaken him to the core.

Really, what I would argue that the biggest difference in Lan Wangji pre and post thirteen years is where he’s just done with trying to win by the rules the cultivation world sets. He’s seen what happens when you follow those rules, how even when you stand up to them in the ways they claim to respect that their words mean nothing, and he won’t give them the benefit of the doubt any longer. Which is something that can only come with maturity and is also something that Wei Wuxian learned in that same time span, Wei Wuxian never turned the defenses he’d made for the Burial Mounds so that they would respond to Jiang Cheng, and Jiang Cheng brought a siege on him.

The answer I have for you anon, is that they both have been equally moral in their youths and more so as adults because they are both learning and growing and developing that core within them as they grow. Be careful not to conflate sacrifice with morality, while it can indeed be a sign of great morals, it is not the only way such morals can be shown, and to suggest that Lan Wangji’s actions - helping others who still need his aid when the Wen are being taken care of by Wei Wuxian, speaking out on their defense, rescuing Wei Wuxian and taking him back to the burial mounds after the events of nightless city, and then surviving and living to save Wen Yuan and to raise him and other children so that they will not make the mistakes their elders did - are less moral because he gave up less than his life to do so is something that I find distasteful indeed.

I have a fic kindddd of similar 2 this? it does involve a jiang sect summer camp (NOT modern au) but unfortunately madam yu is not involved.

Fic name: i’ll be your summer sun forever by xianthepiper

Au where everything is the same, except Madam Yu visits Cloud Recesses before the story starts. She sees Lan Wangji and somehow determines that he is the exact sort of boy Wei Wuxian would fall in love with. So she insists that he attend their dumb summer school and stay there the whole time. Because if he falls in love, she can make him Lan Qiren's problem

Madam Yu: You are going to Cloud Recesses and don't come back until you've had a gay awakening

Rip Adrien Agreste, you would've loved Ezri Dax💔

Hi miss Sophie! I've said this before but haha I love ur art and writing! Ur art style has always been very pleasing to look at :)

questions: how would you see leoya getting together ? And in a previous question someone asked how koya would ask Leo out to a date and you said koya doesn't ask are u saying koya would just kidnap Leo to a romantic dinner XD (haha sorry I just love this ship so much I had to ask)

2)Any character dynamics you would've loved to expand on more?

Ahh that's all! Thank youuu

Hi! Thank you so much for the kind words! <3

I can't imagine Koya would ever allow herself to be romantic in the traditional sense, she'd do something like she'd go up to Leo and be like "WE ARE NOW A COUPLE" and then storm off without explanation, leaving Leo bewildered.

For other character dynamics, I had a plan for more Leo & Casey after the one fight club issue, they were going to be palling around and developing their friendship while Raph and Casey were on the outs, but it never happened. :( That's probably my big one I wish I could have done. I also would've loved to explore Hob and the Weasels more, and Hob in general, how his views on human-born mutants vs animal-born mutants change, how he comes to care about the Weasels even though they used to be human and how he regrets what he's done to them, how he deals with the paperwork that results from Mutant Town and how he kinda unintentionally creates problems for himself and bites off more than he can chew. I really wanted the Turtles and Hob to finally come to a more formal, if uneasy, truce.

Ahh no I promise in not making fun off you </3 lyndon wee Johnson is just so funny because lwj=Lan wangji

Actually Lwj is so much better than me, Cause like the corruption of the cultivation world aside, If I lost my bisexual, raven haired princess who also happens to be a renowned heretic I would've had the crash out of the century.

everytime I remember that lesbian couple that have a marble statue of the two of them embracing and sleeping on a bed together over where their graves will be because the artists didn’t believe they would be able to be married before they died, so what they couldn’t have in life they could have in death, I fucking breakdown

Yilling laozu the biggest star in town!

so... more of these guys

IM SORRY, THEY'RE ON THE NOGGIN 24/7

but yeah, i came up with their designs

Wen ning and wei wuxians bond is so so very special to me.

Where the yilling laozou may be the ghost general won't be far

personally i do think julian bashir is trans, but not in a way that sublimates his genetic alterations into a trans allegory. i think he's disabled and trans at the same time, but i think his rebellion against his parents--the symbolic death of his old self with the name change--that's not about gender, for him, at all.

it's about the incredible violation of autonomy he experienced as a disabled person under the knife of a eugenicist society. it's about the need to reclaim some, any, of the agency that was so completely stolen from him by his parents.

it's about discovering that his entire self was deconstructed and reconstructed, without his knowledge or consent, for the express purpose of being less of a burden on his parents.

because let's not forget that the death of julian's old self was not his decision. it was his parents who killed the old self and created a new one.

let's not forget that human society in star trek is still recovering from the eugenics wars--that just because it's post-scarcity doesn't mean it's a utopia.

let's not forget the multiple episodes where bashir is forced to confront the fact that his "success story" is truthfully a gross reminder of how deeply his society (and his family) hates disabled people, not only shown in how they tried to fix him, but also in the fact that the process so rarely works as intended, yet is still done anyway--and the failures and the ones too far gone to save are locked away! with no connection to general society, and only the bare minimum provision for their physical needs, with no privacy and no autonomy!

and let's not forget that julian sees these people and is torn between the empathy he has for them, and his urge to fix them. and he goes through with this urge on Sarina, "fixing" her to conform to his idea of what she ought to be, treating her as a problem to be solved, objectifying her via "my ideal woman was trapped in this disabled body/mind and i saved her," thus continuing the cycle of violence, because even he can't conceive of a world where the disabled do not need to be fixed. where the violence done to him was wrong. fuck man