What Some People Don't Understand Is That Dabi's Dance Celebration Comes From The Place Of Real Life

Turns out you can smile. A real one, even. And more than once.

I think to think of Spite’s gender as “I’ll have what he’s having”

ik some people like to use it or they pronouns for spite bc spirits don't technically have gender and i understand and respect the hustle but i do think it is so funny that lucanis just assigns spite he/him at possession. lucanis is like oh he looks like me and i am a he/him so spite will be he/him too and spite who has already gotten stuck to the flypaper that is lucanis dellamorte's one and only mortal body doesn't even care. he's just like well yeah this might as well happen

There are already so many delicious meta posts on everyone's specific thoughts on what's going on in Illario's head, but I am jumping in myself because he and Lucanis are making me CRAZY

I think that soooo much of his jealousy is that he and Lucanis get treated as a binary. Damn near every time Lucanis talks about something he is or isn't good at, he brings up how Illario is the opposite. It isn't just that they're constantly being compared (already something that's going to be super damaging to both of them and their relationship) but there's such a strong sense that they're not allowed to overlap.

Like, Lucanis is better at physical combat? Okay, so Illario is bad at it. It doesn't matter that he's still very good, that's he's good enough to still be a living, working Crow at the ripe old age of 30+, as a member of the First Talon's family no less. It doesn't matter that he's good enough to drop down from the ceiling (when and how did you get up there???) and kill Zara before anyone can register he's there. It doesn't matter that he's still a significant boss, even once you factor out the Venatori. He's worse than Lucanis, so Lucanis is the 'good' assassin and Illario is the 'bad' one.

In the reverse, Lucanis's self-esteem about his social skills is in the DIRT. He is CONSTANTLY bringing up how Illario is the people person. Even when, in the same breath, he says Illario only ever had relationships with people he didn't like and they never lasted, he's still saying Illario is better at it. And because Illario is better with people, he's 'good' at it, and Lucanis is 'bad' at it.

In any discussion with or about Lucanis and Illario there is, apparently, zero overlap in their skill sets. Despite the fact that that's very obviously not true. But they've been set against each other so thoroughly that they don't even realize it. Because presumably Caterina started training them and they had a knack for some skills more than others and rather than encouraging them to teach other or partner up to boost each other's strengths, she was most likely going "Look, Illario, your cousin did that move so much better than you, be more like that," and "Lucanis, Illario perfected this ages ago, it is not that hard to convince someone you're harmless" and all they got was that one of them was the assassin and one of them was the conman and never the two shall meet.

And Caterina, of course, heavily favors Lucanis. And I imagine there's a million reasons why - starting with the fact that it sounds like his mother was the last favorite. (And how can Illario compete with that? He'll never be the son of the favorite.) But I think a big reason is Lucanis's skill set. Maybe he's the most like her. Maybe she thinks if he's good in combat, he won't die like all the others did. Has she just written Illario off as a lost cause, certain to get himself killed? Not consciously, I'm sure, but subconsciously? Easy to imagine. Easy for Illario to feel that way, whether it's true or not.

And then!! He's being babysat! This idea that Lucanis is the one who can fight (and therefore Illario cannot) has taken hold so deeply that Lucanis feels like he has to look out for Illario, has to protect him, and of course that's bundled up in the 'we're all we have left' but when you're suffocating under the weight of your cousin being a mother hen that feels much less sympathetic. And when you're a 30+ assassin it's gonna feel pretty aggravating if everyone acts like you need your cousin to help you tie your shoes in the morning.

And I don't think either of them realize this. Introspection is not a Crow skill. All Illario knows is he can't be a good assassin while Lucanis is alive, because only one of them can be a good assassin. And that built and built and I think the opportunity to have Lucanis killed crossed his path, and he - Well, despite what Caterina might think, he is a very good Crow. So he took the opportunity. And then he couldn't go back.

And what does he have, under this binary? At least the good fighter, the good assassin, can have a talent for other athletic work, a passion for knives. At least the favorite can find another hobby without feeling grandmother breathing down his neck, asking why he's learning a new skill when he hasn't even mastered the important one. What's under a conman, a grifter, a politician? Sure, he can make people like him, but he can he ever connect with them enough to like them back? Does he know who he is? Would he know where to begin to try and find out?

I'd argue that - whether he knows it or not - is the biggest reason he tried to have Lucanis killed. He doesn't know who he is other than Caterina's least favorite grandson, Lucanis's cousin. He doesn't know how to find out.

most precious daydream

thinkin about lucanis' struggle with his wants vs. familial expectations, rook being a catalyst for his reach for freedom and understanding the crows from an outside perspective, and all of the cut content and epilogue scenes ...

Collection of Lucanis' thought fragments from Inner Demons quest

Edit: added a Spite one I missed (ty @carabas)

The topic of first relationships played funnily between Lucanis and my Rook. Rook was like: "Well. I wouldn't know how a first kiss tastes like since I've never been kissed before". Lucanis said something like: "In matters of the heart is better not to rush". My Rook was sure that was a patronizing comment coming from someone that probably has kissed dozens of people before.

When they took forever to get together, Rook thought: "Oh, man. He clearly doesn't like me because I'm inexperienced :(". Then that banter between Lucanis and Emmrich happened and Rook was like: "Wait, wait, WHAT? WHAT DO YOU MEAN I'M YOUR FIRST RELATIONSHIP??? YOU WEREN'T BEING PATRONIZING, YOU WERE BEING HONEST!"

Literally have a fic like this planned, Illario is so worried about Spite being the issue that he is completely unprepared for Rook

I can see Lucanis wanting to bring Illario on a contract for old times sake to finally end the bad blood, but Rook trusts Illario about as far as they can throw him and thus they all end up on the World’s Worst Roadtrip where Lucanis is the glue keeping two of them from genuinely killing each other……..

Viago and Teia getting a letter one day (technically it was addressed to just Teia but they were On again so they're reading it together. there's another addressed to Viago waiting in his room which he has not slept in for three days and probably won't find go back to for at least a week more) that says:

We're eloping to Nevarra and Lucanis is abdicating. Giving you a heads up because you're cool. Enjoy the fallout!

Best Regards, Rook and Lucanis Ingellvar

What follows this unceremonious departure from Antiva is a level of chaos rivaling even Zevran's reign of terror as all the Talons scramble to grab the empty seat Lucanis left behind to live his best life as a househusband. House Dellamorte that has limped along clinging to power through blood and cruelty finally falls and in the resulting chaos and confusion either Teia or Viago end up seizing the seat of the First Talon. They're not sure whether to thank Lucanis or strangle him for causing such upheaval. Lucanis is too happy spending his days baking bread and testing out new recipes to really care.

the victory ball

It's just so narratively crunchy that Spite writes poetry as his chosen form of self expression. Especially given that he clearly struggles to communicate with the people around him, the fact that he writes poetry in the scant moments he has command of Lucanis's hands really cements other textual indicators that Spite is frustrated by his difficulty with communicating. Over and over again he asks to talk to Rook, to be heard, but when he does get the chance to talk, he isn't understood, which must be unbelievably frustrating for the poor guy. So he practices! In writing! And that writing gives such a neat look into Spite's mind and how he conceptualizes himself and his situation. So I'm gonna dust off my English degree and yell about his poetry.

1.

a PEACE

cut from the ALL

golden stranded weaves

PROTECTION CAGE

keep them OUT

keep me IN

As with all poetry, there's a lot of room to interpretation, and I think that's especially intentional for Spite's worldview as a spirit. He's from the Fade, which operates on perception and emotion instead of concrete immutabilities like the material world. That being said, I think this first poem is Spite trying to process and talk about a.) his own violent summoning from the Fade and b.) Lucanis's mental Ossuary.

Spite was ripped from the Fade against his will, a piece of a larger infinity cut and captured. Likewise, Lucanis creates the Ossuary in his mind as a (poor) coping mechanism for dealing with what happened. Spite recognizes this as an attempt to create peace in emotional turmoil.

The golden stranded weaves evoke the imagery used in the narration explaining how the dagger cuts through the Veil. It's visually represented as gold geometric lines separating the Fade from the material world, which may be a hint to how spirits see the Veil: a barrier made of gold strands that has also stranded Spite from the world he knew. Given that Lucanis's mind Ossuary is also a part of the Fade, this same barrier applies here as well, stranding him and Spite from the freedom they seek.

The Veil and the mental Ossuary therefore function as what Spite calls a "protection cage," designed both to keep its occupants safe and keep them contained. Arguably, Spite could also be talking about the magic that keeps him bonded to Lucanis, magic that is likely similar in nature to how the Veil works given that blood magic is what sustains both. Protecting Spite and Lucanis from being hurt further by the Venatori but also keeping Spite from going home. He's stuck in Lucanis whether he likes it or not. This is further complicated by the mental Ossuary, which Lucanis has unconsciously constructed to keep the people he loves out of harm's way (protecting them) while also keeping Spite trapped.

This is Spite's first cry for help. He recognizes that he is trapped in multiple ways: he is forced to share a body that aggressively does not want to share with him, and the part of the Fade that Lucanis is connected to mentally is also a prison, one that does not respond like Spite would normally expect the Fade to respond. Lucanis mentions in Sea of Blood that "The Fade does whatever a spirit wants. Real walls and chains, not so much," but Spite tells Rook in Inner Demons that he can't touch the locks in Lucanis's mind despite it technically being a part of the Fade. My personal theory is it has something to do with the blood magic that bound them together in the first place, but regardless of why, it's understandably extremely frustrating for Spite to feel trapped both in the material world and the Fade, neither of which respond to him as he expects. To Spite, it must feel like the very laws of physics have stopped working as they should.

2.

scentsing the BEYOND

rememburnings from before

when one was infinity

not a small shade

not a SHARP hooked claw

in a gut

takemeouttakemeoutletmeout

riiiiip

Here we get to see how Spite has been learning to use language to artistically express complex abstract ideas, which speaks to him having mature, adult intelligence, given that abstract thought is a marker of higher-order cognition. In this poem, Spite is no longer simply describing his situation as he is in the first poem, he is self-reflecting and forming his own identity.

It's clear in this first line and in several points throughout the game that Spite's favorite sense is smell, possibly because it is a sense that he can unintrusively access and therefore isn't barred by Lucanis. So he is not just sensing, he is specifically "scentsing" what he calls "the BEYOND," likely the Fade, referencing his ability to pull things from it (especially considering that the little icon on an accessible spot says "a sense of something").

But he's not just talking about the Fade as a place, he's reminiscing of the Fade as a time. But the portmanteau he uses here, "rememburnings" suggests an attempt to explain the emotion he associates with this remembrance. The memory is painful. It burns. It hurts him. He remembers being a part of the Fade, being part of "infinity," and now he is only a "small shade" of what he once was.

But that's not all. He's also demonstrating that he understands how Lucanis perceives him, sees that he is hurting Lucanis. He knows that he was force-fed to Lucanis (quite literally according to his banter with Bellara where he says it happened when "They fed me something. Like he was a parasite in uncooked meat."), which explains why Spite conceptualizes himself as being a foreign, damaging object "in a gut." And, importantly, he doesn't take satisfaction from that. The tone he is using here suggests grief and desperation, especially the "takemeouttakemeoutletmeout." He wants to be free, yes, but he also wants to stop being an object of pain. And yet the last line suggests that Spite knows that separation would also be painful. It would be another ripping, because he is a claw now. As much as he is trapped by Lucanis, he is embedded in him as well, and extraction would tear them both apart.

3.

toes wiggle

when he drinks the brew

a small shade

and a wounded spirit

sitting

there is STILL

we are still

there is an INFINITE

there is a SHELTER

there is a STORM outside the center

UGH Spite your MIND!!! This poem makes me want to cry fr. It's so much more concrete than the other two, showing how he's becoming more familiar and comfortable with Lucanis's body and the material world. The tone is gentle, like a relieved sigh, with none of the urgency and desperation of the others. This is the first time we see Spite describe a physical sense other than smell. He notes that Lucanis wiggles his toes when he drinks his favorite coffee, suggesting that this is something Spite feels as an occupant of the same body, though he likes to manifest himself as separate. It confirms that he feels what Lucanis feels through shared senses, though has his own interpretations of sensory input.

Spite still conceptualizes himself as a "small shade," but no longer is he a "SHARP hooked claw." He is still hurt, still affected by what he and Lucanis went through, but he now sees Lucanis as more than the body he's trapped in. He sees Lucanis as a fellow "wounded spirit," hurting and healing in the same way that he is. They are sitting together, feeling together, and they have found stillness. They've finally made peace.

While he may no longer be a part of the Fade as he once was, Spite has found that being and living with Lucanis is another "INFINITE" that he gets to experience. He is safe, sheltered in their bond. It's no longer a cage. It's just protection now. And while Spite can feel the absolute mess that's going on with the world and the Fade and everything they're dealing with, he is centered now with Lucanis, which makes it all manageable.

All this leads me to believe that after Inner Demons and their little coffee date with Rook, Spite and Lucanis are at a point in their relationship where Lucanis is much more accommodating of Spite and where Spite is able to explore and experience the material world with a certain level of patience. He no longer feels like he has to bully Lucanis into letting him pilot because he understands physical space now and can experience things alongside Lucanis as he experiences them. Lucanis is more confident letting Spite speak through him because he's no longer worried Spite will wrest complete control from him and/or do something to hurt them. As Lucanis says in the final romance scene, they're no longer afraid. Lucanis now trusts Spite's reports about what happened and how much time has passed while he was asleep, which suggests that Spite has earned that trust.

At this point, the line between demon of Spite and spirit of Determination seems extremely blurry at best, and it really makes me wonder if gaining a physical body through means other than normal possession allows spirits to develop more complex cognition and emotional versatility beyond just their purpose.